r/WhitePeopleTwitter
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u/Thryloz
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May 27 '22
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(GQP) Bans don't work. (Also GQP) Ban abortions.
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u/LovelyRita999 May 27 '22
Per this politifact article, it sounds like the limits on magazine sizes were the more effective part of that bill
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u/Lancashire_Toreador May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22 •
“No strong evidence shows that the ban’s presence or its end caused the change in mass shooting deaths”
When you control for socioeconomic factors and carefully define your research question, edit: (stuff like) mag caps become irrelevant. (Mostly because what these studies call mass shootings are not events where someone went out with the intent of killing indiscriminately )
Closing DV loopholes, making animal cruelty a disarmable offense and raising the purchase age to 21 would cut off the source of weapons used in over 70% of active shooter incidents- the things that actually are what you think of when you hear the word masse shooting.
Let our policy be driven by data, not talking points
Added link
Edit- y’all. Read the whole thing before you comment. There’s a reason they published these results. You’re not showing that it’s wrong when you stop halfway through the analysis where they’ve only reported what the studies they looked at said.
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u/SingularityPrime May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
While mass shooting scenarios shouldn't be ignored, we shouldnt just be looking at that. Those deaths are a drop in the bucket of overall gun homicides
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u/More-Nois May 27 '22
End the drug war and legalize drugs. Would completely cripple gang economy and end motivations for gang violence, which is far and away the biggest source of gun homicides
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u/SnowyBox May 27 '22
More importantly would be getting as many people out of poverty as possible, as poverty is the leading factor in crime rates
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u/MagillaGorillasHat May 27 '22
Cycles of poverty are hard to get out of when kids enter "the system" for being in the same car as a joint or small bag of weed.
Legalizing weed would also dramatically cut down the incentive for police interactions. Cops don't pull a car full of kids over to scold them about their tag lights. Cops use traffic violations as a pretense of looking for weed.
Then they'll use that as leverage to try and flip the users for their dealers, and so on. "We don't care about the weed, we really just want to get the hard drugs and murderers off the streets." is what they tell the kids they arrest. Meanwhile, said kids now have a rap sheet which makes their lives infinitely more difficult.
Fewer police interactions also mean fewer opportunities for things to go sideways and end up with someone getting shot. Fewer cops getting shot, fewer civilians getting shot. Win win all the way around.
Also clearing non violent drug convictions opens up the employee pool and makes it easier for those folks to get out of that poverty cycle by getting better jobs.
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u/PatternBias May 27 '22
Let's be real, that's even less likely to happen than gun control. Politicians actually helping people??
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u/ProtonPi314 May 27 '22
Well let's not put a complete blanket on politicians.
Now I agree that democrats are far from perfect .
But they did put in a child tax credit that helped to take millions of children out of poverty ( but sadly 51 or 52 senators decided to end that. But 100% of the Republican ones did put an end to it)
Democrats did put a bill forward to bump minimum wage to $15 , that would of helped a lot of people, now at $15 you would still be poor , but it's easy better then 7.25.
They also put forward other bills that would improve the lives of Americans, but like usual , 100% of the Republicans in the senate voted against it, and like usual , 2 to 4% of the Democrats voted against it as well.
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u/KrytenKoro May 27 '22 •
What's important is that no matter what solution you try, the fucking GOP is against it.
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u/randobot456 May 27 '22
Keeping the drug war....and every war....going is like the only bi-partisan issue we have here in the States.
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u/scoopzthepoopz May 27 '22
It concludes minimum age requirements have uncertain/ inconsistent effects on mass shootings though.
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u/ferrocarrilusa May 27 '22
I think that's a fair compromise. You can keep your AR15 but you need to reload every 10 rounds
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u/nowiforgotmypassword May 27 '22
I see you've completely ignored 30-50 feral hogs.
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u/dantevonlocke May 27 '22
Let's be realistic, if you're hunting that many hogs you need explosives.
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u/VerbalThermodynamics May 27 '22
If you have that many hogs, you might need to use nerve gas. Don't want hog chunks all over your land, no?
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u/great--pretender May 27 '22
If you're hunting hogs not in a tree with time to reload, you're just an idiot loll
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u/usingastupidiphone May 27 '22
But how will I shoot coyotes and protect my livestock? /s
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u/InsomniacCyclops May 27 '22
Something something 30-50 feral hogs
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u/hattmall May 27 '22
That's what tannerite is for
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u/JPBen May 27 '22
Now be fair. Tannerite has tons of uses. Tree stump? Tannerite. Shooting a target at a distance? Tannerite. Locked your keys in the car? Well, you know what to do.
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u/Rustbeard May 27 '22
It's actually about overthrowing the government but okay.
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u/rnobgyn May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22 •
I’m more concerned about protecting myself from fascist domestic terrorists but sure
Edit due to traction: r/liberalgunowners
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u/Rx710 May 27 '22
Theres a difference?
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u/Dr_Death_Defy24 May 27 '22
Ironically "fascist domestic terrorists" both shot up a school and did nothing to prevent said incident.
Funny how that works.
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u/RobotLoveSong May 27 '22
That’s… that’s not what the 2nd amendment is about at all. It was designed to be the opposite, the population being armed to fight for the country.
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u/GOODbutNotGRAPE May 27 '22
I wonder if that would be different today given the advent of affordable, consumer 3D printers. I can’t imagine it would be hard to manufacture “illegal” sized magazines if you already have the weapon. I suppose it would at least be one more obstacle nonetheless.
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u/Kittykateyyy May 27 '22
Everytime I read something facepalm-worthy, Rebublicans have something to do with it.
I am not American but damn it, someone has do something about these senseless killings!
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u/ApatheticEight May 27 '22
Well damn aren’t you a LIBERAL commie /s
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u/beluuuuuuga May 27 '22
Your comment is funny and sad at the same time because it's exactly what one of these folk would say ( including the /s) to make it seem as if they are joking when they're really actually quite butthurt.
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u/SrslyCmmon May 27 '22
The irony is that the people who rail against communism the most would probably benefit from it. Getting the poor to idolize the rich who then fuck them at every turn is truly an amazing achievement.
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u/TangoWild88 May 27 '22
Socialism, yes. Communism, probably not. Not from any failures on communisim's part, but more the failures of human beings who desire power through authority.
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u/PRtheRights May 27 '22
How about this for "LIBERAL commie propaganda"?
Of the last 12 deadliest shooters with at least 10 murdered,
- 8 used semi-automatic "assault type" rifles or their variants like the AR-15, AK-47 or Sig Saur MCX. Another one (Santa Fe) used a 12 gauge shotgun, another used an AR-style pistol.
- EVERY SINGLE ONE was a US citizen
- 11 purchased their weapons legally
- 11 passed a background check
- Multiple were wearing or looked like they were wearing body armor
- The semi-automatic rifles vastly outgunned any immediate security who only had pistols, many who were fought off or refused to fight.
BAN (or prohibit new purchases of ) SEMI-AUTOMATIC "ASSAULT TYPE" RIFLES..
Yes terrorists will still come, but at least your average security or police won't be vastly outgunned and might actually engage.
The Sutherland shooter was only stopped by another citizen.... who also had an AR-15... and AFTER HE HAD KILLED 27.
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u/KlingoftheCastle May 27 '22
My favorite excuse is “well they still would have attacked with a knife if they wanted to.” Which roughly translates to “If we’re going to be violent, we need to be efficient”
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u/Itchy-Log9419 May 27 '22
I don’t understand how it’s so hard for them to comprehend that a knife wouldn’t have done even a tenth of the damage done at Pulse, or Las Vegas, or Sandy Hook, or any of them. Like how is your solution “well it doesn’t completely eliminate deaths so we’ll just do nothing and let a hundred die instead.” Basically all of their arguments are dumb but the knife one gets me the most lately. I teach (college kids though) and I would 300% rather have an intruder with a knife than an intruder with a gun of ANY kind, but especially a semi automatic. It takes them like 5 seconds to wipe out an entire room. A knife? Okay, while they’re busy trying to get close to stab ONE person everyone else in the room can pretty easily stop him.
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u/ApatheticEight May 27 '22
well it doesn’t completely eliminate deaths so we’ll just do nothing and let a hundred die instead
“People still die after being vaccinated so I will not get one” mentality
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u/Thesafflower May 27 '22
C’mon now, you know the Las Vegas shooter could have done just as much damage throwing knives out the window! People will find ways to hurt each other no matter what, so it’s completely pointless to restrict weapons that make it extremely easy to kill a large number of people very quickly and from a distance.
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u/GameofPorcelainThron May 27 '22
Like... do people not realize how much harder it is to kill large numbers of people with a knife vs a gun??? wtf is wrong with people.
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u/Busy_Independent_398 May 27 '22
police won't be vastly outgunned and might actually engage.
Lol
defund the police
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u/SdBolts4 May 27 '22
Saw a tweet yesterday that said "If the explanation really is, 'a large number of heavily-armed cops decided to just passively let the mass murder of kids continue without intervening.' then the 'abolish the police' people were right all along"
Like...YES! Cops do. not. have. an. obligation. to. help. you.
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u/ChrisPnCrunchy May 27 '22
that first tweet is bootlicking.
the second tweet refers to the BLM/defund movement derogatorily as "the abolish all police people"
this guy isn't an ally, this some /r/selfawarewolves shit.
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u/yellowspotphoto May 27 '22
I hate living here. The amount of people who want to arm teachers, the same teachers they don't trust to not groom kids to be gay, is enraging.
God forbid we put common sense gun laws into place though.
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u/lexbuck May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22 •
Don’t forget the fact that no one seems to want to pay teachers more. Yeah, sure. Let’s pay teachers who are required to have a high level masters degree before they can teach $50k per year (a lot make less) AND require them to carry a gun with them at all times. Yeah that makes perfect sense. Tell me you want all teachers to quit without telling me you want all teachers to quit. But that would fit nicely into the Republican agenda to attack education. No teachers means kids are dumber and likely more warm bodies to vote Republican
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u/NN8G May 27 '22
You assume the existence of common sense. See much demonstrated when it comes to guns? Me, neither.
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u/somethingrandom261 May 27 '22
Democrats proportionally vote less in non-presidential elections. This tendency leads to a overrepresentation of republicans in the federal branch of government that actually puts laws in place, as well as in local government. Every goddam time they don’t show up when it matters. It’s super frustrating, but as a white male I’ll be fine so the ones who suffer most will be the ones who refuse to do their duty when it matters.
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u/WhileNotLurking May 27 '22
That's part of it. It's also a rigged system
The constitution was a balance to protect less populous states against a few big players.
The senate was suppose to be what put them on even levels. The house was to let bigger states have influence as well.
It worked with 13 states.
It failed over time. The Midwest is vast and empty but broken down into a ton of states. This gives certain groups (corn growers) a huge level of influence.
The house was ARTIFICIALLY capped at 425. Big states like California and NY have less representation now because of that cap while other smaller states have a higher level of influence (WY) because they are guaranteed one vote.
In essence the entire system is rigged to less populated states. It's how an extreme party driven by rural desires can impact city life.
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u/MrEHam May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
Actions we need to take:
- Ban AR-15 style rifles
- Ban high capacity magazines
- Strengthen background checks
- Invest in mental health resources and economic help for the poor and struggling. Pay for it by taxing the ultra-millionaires and billionaires.
- Panic buttons in every classroom
- Invest in FBI cyber agents to scan online communities known for radicalizing youth
- Vote out every Republican who opposes gun control and comprehensive spending on mental health services.
- Voluntary gun buy back program.
- Increase taxes on guns and ammo. Use that to help pay for the above.
Please share this list.
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u/Status_Tiger_6210 May 27 '22
How about ammunition limits too? Chris Rock was joking but he hade a good point. Bullet control would work well alongside gun control.
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u/Stiggalicious May 27 '22
We already have that here in California, all ammunition purchases undergo background checks.
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u/watchingsongsDL May 27 '22
I believe that background checks for ammo were thrown out by the 9th circuit court.
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u/kilgorevontrouty May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
You can buy everything to make ammunition online. My father in law has drums of gun powder in case of this eventuality. It would just create a black market that would be lightly prosecuted.
Edit: I have made the logical fallacy of letting the perfect be the enemy of the good. Clearly any barrier to buying tons of ammunition easily would be better than what we have now. I just wanted to point out it would place an additional burden on law enforcement and maybe additional funding should be allocated as well as pointing out the difficulty of getting law enforcement, the justice system to enforce an “unpopular” law.
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u/O2XXX May 27 '22
It’s still a barrier too high for most people. People are still going to murder others, but you can make it harder for them.
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u/frododouchebaggins69 May 27 '22
Thank you. The counter-argument of "people will just make guns and bullets" is not a reason to do nothing. Deterrence works because most people are lazy.
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u/O2XXX May 27 '22
To take it a step further, moving to individually packaged pills (aka blister packs) led to a reduction in suicides from overdose. Think of how small of inconvenience that is, yet it still reduced it by over 20%!
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u/Cad-Banes May 27 '22
Every extra hurdle will dissuade some people. It won't be everyone, but every obstacle added reduces the chance someone goes all the way with it
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u/subject_deleted May 27 '22
"no point in having speed limits, because some people will still speed."
right... but if there's a speed limit, we can pull them over and ticket them.. and eventually if they continue to break the law, we can revoke their driving privilege.
not enacting gun laws on account of some hypothetical future person disregarding said law is one of the dumbest fucking arguments i've ever heard for literally anything. "people will break the law, so we may as well make those things legal. that way nobody can be punished for doing it and they get to call themselves law abiding citizens."
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u/Duke-of-Dogs May 27 '22
I actually completely understand and appreciate your sentiment but system has no problem enforcing unpopular laws, just look at marijuana. They don’t need more funding, they need to change what they’re doing with their already bloated budgets. End the war on drugs, demilitarize and downsize patrol units, and use the hundreds of millions you save to focus on training response teams and generally treating/managing our mental health crisis.
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u/Status_Tiger_6210 May 27 '22
Why not treat it like meth? If pharmacies can limit sales of Sudafed, surely it’s feasible to limit and track sales of powder, casings, slugs etc.
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u/Stiggalicious May 27 '22
Several states already have “assault style” weapon bans. All they do is require you to slap a piece of plastic on the grip and not have other features like a flash hider or vertical forward grip or adjustable stock. These laws do absolutely nothing to reduce the lethality of guns.
In order to have teeth, we would need to ban by function, not by cosmetic features. We would need to ban everything semi-automatic and everything that could be converted into semi-automatic.
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u/dank-nuggetz May 27 '22
We would need to ban everything semi-automatic and everything that could be converted into semi-automatic.
Which is absurd. Semi automatic guns have been around since the late 1800s. They've been commonplace for a very, very long time. People want to find an easy, catch-all solution to this problem and "banning assault rifles" seems like an easy obvious solution. But the larger problem is the underlying societal rot that has been taking place really since mass adoption of the internet and social media.
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u/Medical_Ad0716 May 27 '22
If you want to pay for all that and universal health care and just about any other social programs, just decriminalize drugs and tax the shit out of that.
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u/xMALZx May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
Increase tax on guns and ammo, then use the tax to invest in all the other things you suggested. No wasted money, in theory.
Edit: I missed a word
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u/46n2ahead May 27 '22
Actually let the health organization collect data on gun deaths also
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u/Drg84 May 27 '22
So here's something interesting. Did a quick search on converting an AR-15 to full auto (I'm probably on a watch list now) and immediately got 10 results for kits to do the conversion. 2 of them listed it as AR-15 to M16 conversion.
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u/anubiz96 May 27 '22
Yeah but I don't think any mass shooters really go through the trouble of the conversion.
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u/Rexosorous May 27 '22
i'm all for gun control, but why is the AR-15 always the boogeyman? the AR-15 isn't some crazy advancement in firearms technology that allows it to be more deadly. if you only ban AR-15s, mass shooters will just move on to the next equally deadly firearms platforms (of which there are many). what you need to do is have a more overarching and comprehensive ban to really have an impact. and i'm aware there are states that implement an "assault weapons" ban, but those laws are honestly terrible and don't actually do anything productive.
also, while i'm on the topic, why do people seem to only care about gun violence as it pertains to mass shootings? don't get me wrong, these are terrible tragedies that effect everyone, but why doesn't anyone care about the countless other firearms related deaths (the numbers of which far outweigh those in mass shootings)? did you know that handguns make up more than half of all gun murders and manslaughter in the US (which account for more than 44x the number of deaths than mass shootings)? and yet i only hear about people trying to ban AR-15s and nothing about restricting handguns.
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u/PieEatingJabroni
May 27 '22
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It’s too late, Americans waited too long. Shit should have happened after Sandy Hook but nothing did. Now they’ve spent 10+ years feeding the right-wing propaganda to the point that the right would rather burn the country to the ground than give up their guns.
You all just watched your own police openly admit that they let a bunch of school children die. No sorry, they let your school children die while they saved their own, and prevented you from saving your own children. The biggest example of police admitting you’re all nothing more then collateral damage if need be.
You all should be out on the streets tearing politicians limb from limb, but nah. America died on December 14 2012 along with those kids.
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u/oyisagoodboy May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22 •
America died long before that. America died the moment we started to allow lobbyists to sway politicians and not be accountable. The moment we gave the power to the rich and elite and allowed corruptions to dictate and decide for us. For years we have allowed them to separate us with 24 hour media fear and agendas. Pretty much every single politician, president or public figure in the last 30 to 40 years has had a hand in creating the situation we are now in.
Yes, we should fight. But who and how?
A good chunk of the country didn't want to wear masks when asked. And all the videos and hate that rained down on them was twisted by their bubble to make them believe they were victims so they dug deeper in and doubled down. And the other side, thinking they are right started berating and accusing anyone who didn't completely conform or think like their bubble and digging in and doubling down.
Reddit is a perfect example of that. If you look through any thread you will see people of whatever like mind down voting, degrading, making assumptions and ganging up on anyone who (even if that's not what was said or intended) doesn't share their thoughts or opinions on the matter.
Reddit is actually a perfect metaphor for the state of the country right now. Agree with me, I don't care what you have to say. My opinion is right, yours is garbage. I'm not listening to you. With a bunch of people who just troll, like and appreciate the drama thrown in. And it only reinforces people's view.
Until we as a people can come together and say "I don't understand your view. Can you try to explain it so I can understand it. I see that, and this is my view. How can we come together to do what is best and right for all of us." Without hate and belittling and trying to make others feel small so the crawl back in their bubble that tells them they are not wrong... we will never make changes.
You can't try to break people down and train them like animals. Broken people latch onto the first thing that gives them comfort and are the most dangerous.
This.. this entire system is broken. From the very ground up. We have to change the quality of the food and the water we are putting in our bodies. We have to change the media and hold them accountable for what they are putting in our minds. We have to change the education we are giving to our children. The inequality of our laws and prison. How we treat our poor, addicted, mentally ill. The corruption we are compliant with in our governments down to the local town treasurer. We need to change the hooray for me selfish attitude embedded in everyone. From the privileged person not putting their cart back and telling people to go back to their own country. To the people that steal and take because fuck the system and rules.
But it won't happen. People would rather fight. People would rather be divided. My team is better. My game is better. My music is better. My political view is better. My favorite show is better. My religion is better. My lifestyle is better. My weight is better. My skin color is better. Who I am attracted to is better. My job is better. My materials are better. My education is better. People will find or create ways to separate themselves and focus only on the differences. And we are past the point of being able to collectively except that and find common ground.
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u/condomnugget May 27 '22
Someone once said the world is the way it is because people are the way they are. We have long fought an uphill battle against ourselves. Every inch of progress carved out from a battlefield of wills between two parties unable to see the common ground. The answer to this issue? Well that’s racked the greatest minds for centuries and there’s no answer in sight as of yet.
All I can say is avoid nihilism like the plague. We may not have a solution to problems created by our very selves but pessimism will only drive us further down the dark road.
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u/ReasonableObject3895 May 27 '22
I strongly dislike, I cringe at both types of people. This should have more updates. Group think and destructive collectivism is what is killing us. I wonder if this kids mental illness was exasperated by the relentless propaganda, relentless fear mongering and division in this country.
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u/nillakillakhan May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
America may be on the brink of death, but I’m an American and I’ve still got breath in my lungs, and an overwhelming drive to care for those around me. But I have the same question, who and how? Where do I begin? Sitting here crying in my apartment alone isn’t doing anyone good, especially for me. But 19. 19 children that don’t get to take another breath. That were American. They were alive. And now they are dead. And there is nothing we can do to bring them back. America‘s not dead. And it’s fucked, messed, and overall screaming help at the top of its lungs. But it’s not dead. The average person will go out of their way to be kind, not because they have to, but because that’s who we are as a people. Not just in the US, but globally. We need to stop allowing narcissistic, sociopathic individuals from spreading this kind of ideology. You’re alive, I am alive. And for that, I’m grateful. 19. 19. 19. No more breaths, no more I love yous, no more packed lunches or a kiss before you send them off on the bus. No more birthdays, no more worrying whether they’ll be OK in life. No more. If you think America is dead, then you’re part of the problem. If you feel dead inside, and you’re doing nothing about it but preaching that all of America is dead inside, you’re part of the problem. Seriously. You might not be to the point of shooting up a classroom of innocent children, but everybody needs a therapist, or somebody to talk to. And perpetuating that mindset? It’s not gonna do any good for anybody. 19
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u/mildmuffstuffer May 27 '22
Good luck convincing Texas to empathize and admit that current gun laws are a joke. Or any gun-toting redneck POS for that matter…
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u/haveanairforceday May 27 '22
Texas had more restrictive gun laws than most western states until very recently. They are just super susceptible to political drama recently (that's by design) but they will be forced to normalize in the coming years. Shit, Beto O'Rourke is openly calling for gun control and he almost won the Senate a couple years ago. Just because the tacticool idiots are screaming the loudest doesn't mean they are 100% supported
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u/usingastupidiphone May 27 '22
It’s easy to point a finger at one event or date but you have to look at more events leading up to our current state of affairs. It’s more complicated and reaches farther back than Sandy Hook.
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u/Mechanical_Nightmare May 27 '22
it's almost as if republicans arent qualified to govern.....
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u/goferking May 27 '22
It wouldn't be so sad if people didn't keep electing them after they campaign on either not governing or bragging about how unqualified they are to do anything
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u/moss-n-choss May 27 '22
Well they move the goalposts and rewrite the rules each time too. That’s why after the recent presidential loss for Republicans, they set to work at the state level to disenfranchise more voters and have less accountability and transparency around voting.
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u/thats_so_raka May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
I think that if you have at any time said things like "I want to impose a Christian moral order", you should be disqualified from running for public office, because you've shown that you will not preserve the separation of church and state.
ETA: this isn't a hypothetical either, look up Jacky Eubanks, running for state rep in Michigan. She's very open about wanting to force everyone to live under Christian sharia law.
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u/MyKneesAreOdd May 27 '22
Almost as if republicans are conmen gaining votes with flase belief in religion and emotionally charged phrases like "freedom"
Republican supporters don't even understand the concept of freedom.
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u/Fun-Tadpole785 May 27 '22
The truth is Republicans are forcing a rape victim as young as 10 to give birth, while being against any type gun control and let any 18 year old own an AK/AR.
This is psychopathic behavior, I now believe these people wouldn't care if it was their own child.gunned down during math.
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u/Stiggalicious May 27 '22
Remember this come November, vote these assholes out. If democrats increased their turnout by just 5% they would win in a landslide and possibly have a filibuster-proof majority that could actually pass gun laws and abortion rights laws.
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u/Typical-Ad-6042 May 27 '22
Yeah this was a turning point for me. I generally believed that conservatives could be reasoned with the correct argument, and that issues were often nuanced enough, that you could occasionally take their arguments in good faith.
But this year? We have evidence that gun bans are effective in other countries, hell even in our own country. When the stakes literally include dead children. I thought, for sure, they would listen to reason. But no.
It’s mindless defense of 2A, they deflect with prohibition (even though evidence shows that prohibition was effective in reduction), the war on drugs (not even remotely the same, but also you can find evidence of reduction in other countries), they deflect to mass stabbings (complete willful ignorance that a stabber on a rampage is demonstrably less destructive than a shooter), they deflect to mental illness (even though other countries with mental illness do not have this same problem), they deflect to the “laws only stop good guys” argument, willfully ignoring that not every bad guy is capable of getting an illegal weapon, and can be evidenced by a bad guy not defaulting to the most destructive weapons in existence and rather because of availability and ease, they use guns… then they even contradict themselves and say they would never give up guns because it’s to defend against the government (indicating that a gun ban would be so effective, they’d be helpless).
Every possible argument can be given, with one of the highest stakes in almost any political issue, and they just don’t care. They defend an ideology rather than doing anything, anything that could result in a reduction of dead children and dead adults.
I’m just dumbfounded honestly. There is no alternative possible reason someone would need an assault weapon, no day to day life adjustment, no sacrifice in daily routine, even in a condition where they truly believe a ban would be ineffective, they are not willing to even humor the idea to reduce the death of other people.
It’s just astounding. They literally are trying to push legislation looking to prevent abortion in ectopic pregnancies, ectopic, literally something that will result in the death of both beings. Yet the right to not be killed by pregnancy is somehow “less complicated” than the right to own automatic weapons.
I just fucking can’t with these people anymore. All hope is just gone, they aren’t reasonable, they aren’t even fighting in their own best interest anymore.
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u/Respectful_Chadette May 27 '22
r/ExposingFascism is about exposing these people's sociopathy.
Let's vote blue. Spread the word.
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u/vickyinepa
May 27 '22
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The fact that the GOP values unborn people more than live, breathing, real people tells you everything you need to know about this damn country.
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u/Grogosh May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
They don't give a damn about fetuses. They care about regressing society to where women were tightly controlled by the men.
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u/Morgana2020 May 27 '22
Made the mistake of popping over to r/conservative, my God...
I understand more now about the echo chamber people live in. From watching this sub and seeing American late night shows, it seemed that people were feeling united and this might be the tragedy that finally forces change. 2 minutes scrolling on conservative has sadly disabused me of that hope.
I honestly don't know how Americans will ever get through this together. Heartbreaking.
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u/TheRealJohnRedCorn May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
I work in the oilfield where 90% of my coworkers are hard line Q-anon conservatives. Their main talking points after this shooting were 1. “Should have had an armed guard at the school” (there was one, he did nothing; neither did actual police). 2. “The shooter was trans, but I bet you won’t read about that in the mainstream media!” (because he wasn’t) 3. “The shooter was not white, so the liberal media narrative is totally false” (they see this as some sort of “gotcha” even though the shooter ticked every other box on the mass shooter profile list).
Edit: when you bring up the fact that armed guards haven’t in anyway helped to thwart recent mass shootings, they will say that it’s because we’re using idiot mall cops as guards, when we should really be using combat veterans. You know, the guys that have PTSD and have actual experience killing children overseas.
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u/Respectful_Chadette May 27 '22
The cops who prevented the families from saving their children were white
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u/alaskaj1 May 27 '22
there was one, he did nothing;
The details on this keep changing. Last I read the officer wasnt at the school but headed to the scene and was there within a few minutes of the call going out .
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u/highdefrex May 27 '22
That thread where they're all bitching and crying about Biden and the $10k college debt relief--that some of them paid off their debt, so why should anyone else get off a little easier?
I swear... Imagine science finally developed a cure for cancer, and by some miracle, it was being expedited for free to people dying of it or made super affordable. Most of them would go, "Now, wait a minute. Why should they get a cure for free/cheap, when I had to suffer through it but my treatments were successful?" or "Why should they get a cure when I had to watch someone I know die to cancer?"
All these people ever think about is themselves. No one else is allowed to benefit from anything, ever, period, unless they do, too -- and even then, it's a gamble -- and important issues that matter to groups/others don't matter at all until they affect a conservative directly.
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u/blackwaltz4 May 27 '22
Nail on the head. It's all about selfishness with them. All of the conservatives I know in real life live by the mantra "At least I got mine." I was talking to one friend about something progressive a few years ago and he straight up said "You first." And I'm like, why not together?
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u/Draiko May 27 '22
Does banning abortion, alcohol, and weed work too?
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u/texmx May 27 '22
Republicans: "Gun control laws won't work, criminals will still be able to get guns, so there is no point!!"
Sane people: "OK, Abortion bans won't work because people that need abortions will still be able to get one even if it's illegal/back alley, so there is no point!"
Republicans WITHOUT A HINT OF IRONY: "Yes, but we have to try! If these abortion laws save just one precious embryo or help reduce abortions even just a tiny bit, it is worth it!! All lives matter! Praise Jesus!"
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u/NegroniHater
May 27 '22
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This is completely false. He is referencing an article that defined a mass shooting as 6 or more people killed, while the FBI definition is 3 or more people killed.
Total mass shooting deaths stayed relatively the same before and after the AWB although school shootings have actually dropped since then. Columbine happened during the AWB, and the shooters used AWB compliant weapons with 10 round magazines.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-data/
https://time.com/4965022/deadliest-mass-shooting-us-history/
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u/thr3sk May 27 '22
Another good study - http://jpfo.org/pdf03/Homicide%20Studies-2014-Fox-125-45.pdf
Yeah it seems the ban's effect was pretty minimal.
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u/CalabreseAlsatian May 27 '22
The GOP has utterly abandoned any kind of rationality. They refute data that is plain as day. It’s disgusting.
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u/dank-nuggetz May 27 '22
They didn't drop by 43%, not even close actually. This guy is intentionally spreading incorrect statistics.
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u/xxpow3llxx May 27 '22
Columbine caused a domino effect people don't want to acknowledge. Unfortunately more coverage inspires more shooters.
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u/DKmann May 27 '22
My dad said the day after Columbine that it would stand as an inspiration for future assholes. He said this will become the new norm for disaffected youth. He was upset at the way the 24 hour news cycle was obsessed with it and figured it showed crazies how to get a lot of attention. Looks like he was right
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u/whyreallywhy May 27 '22
This is such a gotcha! Well until you actually read up on all the mass shootings and find out that most were done with firearms that wouldn't have been banned under the assault weapons ban. Why are people that want these bans allergic to facts? Yes we need gun reform, but we aren't going to get it if the people pushing the most for it aren't willing to learn about guns and how they are used.
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u/JE_Friendly May 27 '22
Republicans don’t care about dead children. It actually makes them happy because they get to scare their subhuman voters into believing someone is really coming for your gun this time. Not to mention the black president is still out there and your wives all fantasize about him.
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u/getut May 27 '22
What if I told you that it is irrelevant? In the United States, guns are a guaranteed right. There is no level of things that bad people do, that should infringe on the law abiding ones. The government is not my protector. Yes they punish after the fact, and they provide incentives on not doing bad things to begin with, but they are no ones protectors. Stop trying to be that.
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u/BlancoMuerte May 27 '22
Why do people take this information at face value? This is complete false.
Sensational rhetoric fixes absolutely nothing and only causes more disdain.
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u/ShinyPachirisu May 27 '22
The ban didn't cause a drop in mass shooting deaths, it remained the same as the previous decade. Mass shootings only went up 2-3 years after the gun ban ended.
If we're being intellectually honest it's obvious that the bill didn't affect mass shootings either way. Correlation is not causation.
In my opinion it's much more likely you see the spike due to the rise of social media/internet culture. All the people that enshrine school shooters create safe spaces and echo chambers where they can idolize them. As silly as it may sound, we've had "assault" rifles for 8 decades without this problem
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u/osprey94 May 27 '22
If we're being intellectually honest
that doesn't happen on reddit when it comes to gun control. full stop. people will upvote shit like this and they don't even wanna talk about it. how can someone explain why banning collapsible stocks would prevent mass shootings? they can't.
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u/adventureremily May 27 '22
Never mind the piss-poor comparison to abortion, where conservatives could just as easily manipulate the argument in the opposite direction. 🤦♀️
"If bans are so effective, then banning abortion should work the same! Checkmate, libs!" (/s in case that isn't glaringly obvious)
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May 27 '22
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u/sucksathangman May 27 '22
Unpopular opinion: this won't change until the schools where the children of Republican elected officials attend are subject to a school shooting.
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u/remotectrl May 27 '22
Someone shot a bunch of congressmen at a baseball game and it didn’t change their minds
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u/Sierra_12 May 27 '22
Dude. A guy shot at Republican senators during a congressional baseball game. If that didn't change, they won't change.
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u/fenris52223 May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
Cherry picked data…
https://www.statista.com/statistics/811487/number-of-mass-shootings-in-the-us/
Mass murder hovered between 0-2 from 1982 to 1990. There was a small spike in 1992-93, but there was also one in 1999 during that ban. Total numbers averaged 0-3 up to the 2008 recession. Then there was another significant jump in 2012, and another in 2017.
There’s no cut and dry correlation to this assault weapons ban, just cherry picked data and bias. Total mass murders are increasing though, and they seem to correlate with our extreme partisanship and hatred of one another. Lots of spikes in times of domestic unrest.
EDIT: it’s not all doom and gloom though. Total murders per year are better than previous years. There’s just some really evil people who do horrible things to large groups and make the news.
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u/Smiley_Smith May 27 '22
Literally can-not rely on police, and that’s never been more evident. Just look at those useless fucks in Texas. Law enforcement is barely present at all in rural America as it is.
I’m not giving up my guns.
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u/dimaswonder May 27 '22
Statistics, please, with sourcing. I'm old enough to remember the debate over extending the ban. Dems didn't have any statistics to show shootings from rifles decreased in the ten years the ban was in effect.
Let's see FBI statistics, the only ones that matter. The FBI annual crime survey has the breakdown of every subject conceivable. Each survey is still online. Let's have the links to the relevant pages.
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u/Robertron54 May 27 '22
Wait so where's the full data for this? What % of mass shootings had an assault rifle 1 year before the 94 ban and even though the ban was in effect what % of mass shootings still had assault rifles the year following. Same questions again for the year the ban expired along with some credible sources. I'm not trying to deny bans don't work anything but I can claim my farts smelled like a dead rat in 2008 causing the housing market to crash and after 2018 when my farts now smell like a corpse it lowered the housing market prices. Just because they share something in common doesn't mean they are actually related, im not gonna trust some random statement without anything backing it is all.
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u/Daedalus308 May 27 '22
Shootings did decrease that is correct. They decreased at the same rate they were already trending at, the repeal of the AWB did not change that rate. The rate started changing when they changed the definition of mass shootings, and recently.... During an election year of course
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May 27 '22
Sorry, but just fucking no. I realize this might be shouting into the Reddit abyss, but... no.
The 1994 "Assault Weapons Ban" banned cosmetic features of certain fireams. You could still VERY much buy an AR15 type rifle that was still VERY much just as deadly as one you buy right now, but it wouldn't have a threaded barrel and bayonet lug, two things that are utterly irrelevant to a lunatic shooting up a room full of people.
It did ban new production of magazines with a capacity over 10 rounds, but grandfathered existing ones and in cases of AR type rifles, there were supplies of pre-ban examples FOR GENERATIONS.
Perhaps the 1990s had an amazing economy, perhaps there was a cultural optimism, perhaps we didn't have huge groups of people who demonized each other ANYTHING like we have today and yes, while there were problems, and some bad stuff happened, culturally speaking, we had essentially the same 'guns' as we did, today, but for the most part, we weren't a civilization bent on demonizing groups of people?
Our culture has failed and there is no savior. A high-trust thing like gun ownership cannot exist in a society like we've become, without events like we're enduring.
In many ways, we've failed as a society... and no, whoever votes opposite of you is not the problem. You thinking that, is the problem...
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u/lion872015 May 27 '22 edited May 27 '22
Does anyone have a source for this? My brief wiki stent on Clinton’s assault WEAPON ban said
It didnt make a meaningful difference
“However, other analyses using a variety of national and local data sources found no clear ban effects on certain types of mur- ders that were thought to be more closely associated with the rapid-fire features of assault weapons and other semiautomat- ics equipped with large capacity maga- zines. The ban did not produce declines in the average number of victims per inci- dent of gun murder or gun murder victims with multiple wounds.”
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u/ted_and_shoulders May 27 '22 •
Ted Cruz jerks off into Airbnb shampoo bottles